Curse

NukeItAll · Jun 03, 2008, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Allright, there's something that's bothering me.

I'm looking through builds on pvx wiki, and I notice that everything differs. With that I mean for example a build that requires 12+3+1 death magic and then another builds requires 12+1+1 death magic.

If I would have to buy a new helm with the neccesary runes for every build I want to play, it would probably cost me a load of money. On the other hand, the damage between 12+3+1 and 12+1+1 is notable in some cases.
For example, If I want to play a minion bomber with Death Nova, a 14 death magic death nova will do 95dmg, while a 16 death magic does 105dmg. That's 10 dmg on every trigger. Now I'm probably to much of a noob to conclude if the 10dmg will be notable, but to me it looks like quite a bit. Same thing with SS. its 33dmg with 14 curses and 37dmg with 16 curses.

So, will I do fine by buying all the helms with a +1 rune (14 of the attribute in total) or should I really put +3 runes on specific builds.

Sorry for typos or weird lines, but I'm not really good at explaining things in english.

Taiya · Jun 03, 2008, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Your english is fine to me, and I simply advise that you get 4 different helmets that will give you + 4, for example, Death helmet, +1 +3, or, Blood helmet, +1 +3
The change of 2 attributes is quite major especially in some skills.
In pve, best to just do the max damage you can - nothing is balanced anymore anyway.

Cathode_Reborn · Jun 03, 2008, 10:11 PM // 22:11

imo using a major for all builds is fine. Only time I ever run a sup rune is in an MM build. Other than that, I only use 1 major.

Outside a pure MM build, it's never worth using a sup rune. The slight gain never makes up for the -40hp lost.

GaaaaaH · Jun 03, 2008, 11:45 PM // 23:45

but 16 Death vs 16 death is 1 minion, which improves the efficiency, and the 40hp should be nothing as you shouldnt be on the front line getting hit.

The Meth · Jun 04, 2008, 01:06 AM // 01:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn

Outside a pure MM build, it's never worth using a sup rune. The slight gain never makes up for the -40hp lost.

On the other hand, -40 health never matters unless you would have been dropped between 0 and -39 health with a superior rune. For PvE everyone who doesn't suck at staying alive should be fine with a single sup.

Turbobusa · Jun 04, 2008, 08:25 AM // 08:25

People put +1+1 because they don't like the health loss but for general PvE, going +1+3 is fine, allows you to have one more minion and is better for sacrificing.

NukeItAll · Jun 04, 2008, 09:55 AM // 09:55

Allright, but what about the other armor parts?
Should I put minor runes on the rest? Or just +1+3 on the helm and nothing on the rest? Cause if I have for example a +3+1 curses helm, a +1 curses on gloves wouldn't do anything.

Turbobusa · Jun 04, 2008, 10:02 AM // 10:02

Well if you are to change build often you have to make some compromises. Curse is generally used in other builds, you could keep the minor rune of curse even if that would do nothing in a build using the +4 curse headpiece.
If you use blood magic more, then go for +1BM...
Of course you'll want a minor soul reaping rune, and a vigor rune (not in MM builds, but I don't feel like getting into full details)

Chthon · Jun 04, 2008, 04:58 PM // 16:58

1. Minion builds absolutely require the full 16 spec. No if's, and's, or but's.

2. Most of the folks around here saying that minor runes are the only option for everything haven't really taken a close look at weighing the benefits of 2 extra ranks against 75 max-hp; mostly they're just repeating it because it's trendy around here.
75 max-hp does not matter very much in PvE (how often do you find yourself within 75 hp of dead, but not die?) and key necromancer skills in every line do gain a lot from extra ranks (Minions gain damage, life, and armor, and you can make more of them; MoP, Barbs, and SS all multiply a small damage increase over a huge number of triggers, resulting in a huge net increase; as do the orders spells.

3.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NukeItAll

Allright, but what about the other armor parts?
Should I put minor runes on the rest? Or just +1+3 on the helm and nothing on the rest? Cause if I have for example a +3+1 curses helm, a +1 curses on gloves wouldn't do anything.

If you really want to get fancy about it, you need a second piece of armor that also swaps. For example, you would take off your curses headpiece and blood gloves, then put on your blood headpiece and curses gloves (assuming your curse build had some blood skills and you blood build had some curse skills). If you don't want to put in that much effort, it won't kill you to keep a redundant minor or two on your armor so you can build-swap by just changing the headpiece.

legacyofkain85 · Jun 06, 2008, 07:43 PM // 19:43

i prefer using minor runes,and if u are using pvx wiki builds u should focus mostly on the actual skill set and not the attributes ,i set the attributes how i think its better and yes i do use pvx wiki builds aswell altho most of the times i end up changing them.

Kawil · Jun 06, 2008, 11:04 PM // 23:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn

imo using a major for all builds is fine. Only time I ever run a sup rune is in an MM build. Other than that, I only use 1 major.

Outside a pure MM build, it's never worth using a sup rune. The slight gain never makes up for the -40hp lost.

Of course, there are other reasons to have a Sup Rune besides just max damage. It allows you to take some attribute points from your main (ex: curses in my builds) and put those points into other attributes. Frees up some latitude to use other skills outside of your main profession. Also, as someone has already mentioned, -40 HP (between Sup and Major) is really not that big of a deal if you know how to play a necro.